Stop Collecting Contacts. Start Connecting.

Guests: Amber Miller, Alison Fragale, and Lisa Hurtz

This episode of unPACKed with PMMI is a playback from a PPWLN Learning Circle focused on Connections. Alison and Lisa share why meaningful professional relationships are built through empathy, curiosity, and being helpful, not transactional networking. Walk away with simple, practical ways to build connections that last in the packaging industry.

Amber Miller: I'm Amber Miller. Thank you for joining today's learning circle focused on connections. I want to thank our gold sponsors of PPWLN, Morrison Container Handling Solutions, and ProMach. And I'm Amber Miller. I'm the Director of Marketing for PMMI Media Group, and I'm really excited to welcome our two guests today, Alison Fragale and Lisa Hertz. And we'll actually just dive right in. How important is it really to stay connected to other professionals after an event?

Alison Fragale: Obviously, the answer is important. You wouldn't network in the first place and go to these events if you didn't think that meeting people was valuable. And of course it is, but I think the key is, and I know we'll talk about this, is how to decide... First of all, not every meeting is equally valuable. And it's okay to let someone come in your life at an event, and it was an enjoyable conversation, and maybe nothing else comes from it. But to prioritize who the most important people are to build those relationships with, and you could use a lot of different criteria, including your own career goals.
And then I think the second thing is, how do you make it easy and efficient? Because the easier and efficient you make it, then that... Normally, when people don't stay connected, it's not because they didn't want to; it's because life happened, and you go back to a full inbox and a family that needed you. And by the time you dig yourself out of that, the event is so in the rearview mirror that you completely forget about it. The easier we can make it with a variety of different little hacks and habits, the easier it is to keep up with at least some of the people.

Lisa Hertz: Networking, for me, I don't go into it thinking I need to make connections. I go in thinking I'm looking for friends and companions in my industry, and that makes it so much easier for follow-up. And I don't go in thinking I could potentially get a sale from this person or I'm looking to do business with them, but just go in knowing that the packaging industry specifically is such a small world, and people are going to have connections. And if you find people that you connect with and you become friends with, genuine friends with, it's going to end up trickling down and helping you in the long run.

Alison Fragale: And to add to that as well, friendship and how you can help them.

Lisa Hertz: Yep. Yep.

Alison Fragale: How can you serve them? One of the things I do when... I often go to these events as a true stranger, and I'm not in the industry. I'm speaking there, and I meet all these people. And when I listen to people in a chitchat situation, I've trained myself to think, what's their story, what do they care about, and is there anything you know or you have to offer that could be helpful? That can range from all kinds... helpful in all the ways.
Someone says, "Oh, I'm getting a new puppy," and you're like, "I just did that six months ago. Let me tell you, this little puppy product saved my life." Or we were chitchatting mom things as we were all in the room beforehand, and you're like, "Let me tell you..." When I hear someone's story, it doesn't have to be in the context of my work expertise. Anything you have that adds value to somebody is still value you add. When I network, especially as an introvert, that's what I'm thinking about, is if I'm going to be here anyway, how can I be maximally helpful in the most efficient ways possible? And that's always a nice way to start a relationship. What they get from you, even if it's five minutes of chatting, is, "Oh, you gave me a resource or a link or a help or something."

Amber Miller: There's the obvious if someone might want to be left alone and not continue to stay connected, but how do you know if someone wants to stay connected or if they want to be left alone? It can be hard to communicate through email or texting sometimes and read those signals. Do you have any advice there?

Alison Fragale: I think one is if you're meeting someone for the first time, it's okay to say, "Is it okay if I connect with you on LinkedIn, follow up with you, send you an email?" Whatever it is. And even if they want to say no, it's hard to say, "No, it's not okay. I really would appreciate it if we never spoke again." They're probably going to say yes. And at least once they say yes, then at least you have permission to make the initial outreach.
And then I think you read the room just like you do in any other thing, but keep in mind, back to these other things that Lisa and I are talking about, is when you show up, if all you're doing in the beginning is showing up by saying, "Hey, this thing is really cool. I thought you might enjoy it," people probably aren't going to want you to go away. You're not asking for anything. They don't even need to respond. Who gets really annoyed by that if they are sending you something that's even mildly interesting? And so if you're doing that occasionally, you probably aren't going to have an issue.
One of the women that I follow on social has this rule of no asks for one year, which I don't necessarily follow strictly, but I see her point, which is that when you've met somebody, within the first year of knowing them, you should not ask them for anything. Now, we may not always have that luxury, and there might be situations where making the ask makes a ton of sense, but I think the idea is just focus on when you show up for a while, show up in service, even if the service is a photo, and then you don't have to worry about going away. Normally, when someone wants us to go away, it's because we're asking them to give something that's too big or too early in the relationship, and then they are not interested in giving. But if you're not asking and you're only serving, I think it's a lot less risky.

Lisa Hertz: Yeah, I would agree with that. I feel like I've been very lucky that, in all my discussions with people that I meet at the women's breakfast or things like that, I'm not going in with a sales pitch, so they have no other reason not to want to have a connection, because I'm not going in with any agenda. And there are those people that are a little bit awkward, and they come in and they're like, "I work for so-and-so company, and this is what I do." And those people, it's a little harder to connect with, because you're like, "I feel like this is only work-related." When you meet somebody who has a personality, a background, and you're able to have that conversation with them, I would say more often than not, they're going to be happy to hear from you at some point. They're not going to be disappointed because you've created that social relationship, not just a salesy work relationship.

Alison Fragale: The science of liking, because sometimes [inaudible 00:06:11] women, women are often told to be likable and you're not likable enough, and so a lot of people get reactants to likability, which I get. But if you look at the science, liking is one of the biggest bases of influence that psychology has ever adopted.

Lisa Hertz: It's true.

Alison Fragale: You know this happens, right? You get a request, let's say, from a colleague, and it's inconvenient, but you really like them, so you're like, "Of course, I'm going to bend to say yes." But you get the exact same request, or even a much easier one, from someone you don't really like, and you're like, "Sorry, not available." We're not doing it based on the request; we're doing it based on how much we like the person asking. And so be liked. And that comes from being a person, having interest, being fun to talk to, showing up with something other than an ask, showing up with something in service to them, et cetera, and then they like you. And then they're like, "Oh, even if what you're asking me is a little bit inconvenient, I want to try to help you out," as opposed to people who just jump in with the ask immediately.

Lisa Hertz: And I think empathy is a really big thing, too. If you're able to hear what other companies are going through and have that empathetic understanding, then you automatically build a connection. Because so many companies, specifically in packaging right now, they've been going through a lot with tariffs and changes in labor rates, and just there's so much going on, that if you can just have that empathetic conversation with somebody, I think it really goes a long way, and you really build that connection.

Alison Fragale: Liking is a big basis of influence, and the biggest basis of liking is similarity. We have something in common. When you listen to someone's story and you can commiserate in some way, or you have some shared connection, "I went through that, too," or whatever, you're creating the similarity. And as soon as people see that you're like them, then they like you more. That's why the personal chitchat ends up actually being very professionally related, because... Like I talk about the fact that I ride Peloton a lot, and a lot of people do, and then people will instantly be like, "Stop. Okay, who's your favorite instructor? Have you done this?" They all of a sudden are like, "I need to know. What's your Peloton name?" And all that stuff, and they're like, "Oh, you're like me. Oh, I trust you more. I'm more inclined to want to work with you." And you're like, "That's so silly." The fact that I ride a bike and you ride a bike isn't really a thing, but human beings, similarity, liking, and influence.
When you're in those conversations, what I'm always paying attention to is something like this, at least, is talking about that says, "We can share a moment over this." It doesn't matter what it is. It doesn't have to be work-related. As soon as you share a moment and someone's like, "That person gets me," then the liking is a halo that goes across everything.

Amber Miller: And then a full circle moment, when you see something that you like that's on that same subject, you can send it to that person. Yeah, that's great. Thanks for sharing.

Lisa Hertz: Yeah.

Amber Miller: And thank you, Allison, and thank you, Lisa, so much for all of your input and suggestions. I know I even learned a lot myself, so I'll be taking that with me in personal and professional connections that I've made as well. Thank you both so much for your time.

Lisa Hertz: Thank you.

Amber Miller: Yes.

Alison Fragale: Of course, my pleasure.

Amber Miller: Thank you.